For very long encounters...

Should there be a way for PCs to get back encounter powers or use surges?

Just a thought...

I believe a normal encounter lasts around 10 rounds but we've had a few that has lasted 20-30 rounds.

Should PCs have a way to recharge encounter powers or should it be up to the DM to limit the size of encounters? Or is it the PCs fault for extending an encounter so no recharge is neccessary?

If encounters are balanced it shouldn't be a problem.

To be fair, a lot of the really long encounters are due to the players continuing to pursue and fight. The DM often gives an escape route or has a particularly tough enemy flee, and it's the player's choice to slug it out instead of taking a break.

Trevor wrote:To be fair, a lot of the really long encounters are due to the players continuing to pursue and fight. The DM often gives an escape route or has a particularly tough enemy flee, and it's the player's choice to slug it out instead of taking a break.

True, but the last encounter was a mix of both.

The vampires and succubus were probably enough for a single encounter while Luke was about two encounters worth by himself.

Having extended encounters from time to time isn't a bad idea, I'm just wondering if PCs should have a way to recovers some resources.

There are potions and items when we get higher that let you use a surge to regain an encounter power and regain more hit points. We're just not at those levels yet.

Dwarmaj wrote:I'm just wondering if PCs should have a way to recovers some resources.

To Trevor's point, the PCs do & did have ways.

Dwarmaj wrote:The vampires and succubus were probably enough for a single encounter while Luke was about two encounters worth by himself.

This could have been 2 encounters or one. I tried to make it obvious that clan Mui & clan Aralius had a tenuous alliance and that clan Aralius (Succubi & Luke) had no respect for clan Mui (sped & minion Vamps). A good diplomacy/bluff check and/or good roleplaying could easily have broken this encounter into two.

Also, "2 encounters by himself"? At least Mick & Ross seem to agree with me that there was no time any PC was in any real danger of dying. (which did surprise me, btw... a lot!) Just how unchallenging do you want encounters to be? I hope you're exagerating here.

Imo, what extended this encounter was:

Lack of roleplaying to give yourselves a 5 minute rest before fighting Luke. He hated the alliance betwen the clans, and was supremely confident in his abilities to take the party out, and he 'knew' he had escapes if things went bad. This wouldn't have been hard, but the party opted for straightforward hack & slash...

The heirloom sword wasn't radiating for many rounds (5-6?), each round was 10 points of regeneration instead of 10 hits of sunlight vulnerability, so about 100 hit point difference. (Just for Luke, 5/5 for other Vamps)

The party chose to pursue when clearly the battle was over & won, and had to fan out to catch him when he was still fairly fresh...

Healing potions were poorly distributed prior to battle. I don't think anybody would have dropped at all if everyone had at least a couple potions, but as it turned out, the ones with potions weren't the ones that needed healing...

Okay, also the fact that he was an 11th level solo with 488 hits and 2 surges for 122 more each, 27 AC & 26 Fort, and can hit for around 30 hits/rnd when most of the party only has 50-60 hit points full up, contributed...


All in all, I really see no need to modify the rules to reset encounter powers faster.

Boards are pretty dead, just trying to spark some conversations...

bradly wrote:
This could have been 2 encounters or one. I tried to make it obvious that clan Mui & clan Aralius had a tenuous alliance and that clan Aralius (Succubi & Luke) had no respect for clan Mui (sped & minion Vamps). A good diplomacy/bluff check and/or good roleplaying could easily have broken this encounter into two.

Also, "2 encounters by himself"? At least Mick & Ross seem to agree with me that there was no time any PC was in any real danger of dying. (which did surprise me, btw... a lot!) Just how unchallenging do you want encounters to be? I hope you're exagerating here.

Imo, what extended this encounter was:

Lack of roleplaying to give yourselves a 5 minute rest before fighting Luke. He hated the alliance betwen the clans, and was supremely confident in his abilities to take the party out, and he 'knew' he had escapes if things went bad. This wouldn't have been hard, but the party opted for straightforward hack & slash...

The heirloom sword wasn't radiating for many rounds (5-6?), each round was 10 points of regeneration instead of 10 hits of sunlight vulnerability, so about 100 hit point difference. (Just for Luke, 5/5 for other Vamps)

The party chose to pursue when clearly the battle was over & won, and had to fan out to catch him when he was still fairly fresh...

Healing potions were poorly distributed prior to battle. I don't think anybody would have dropped at all if everyone had at least a couple potions, but as it turned out, the ones with potions weren't the ones that needed healing...

Okay, also the fact that he was an 11th level solo with 488 hits and 2 surges for 122 more each, 27 AC & 26 Fort, and can hit for around 30 hits/rnd when most of the party only has 50-60 hit points full up, contributed...


All in all, I really see no need to modify the rules to reset encounter powers faster.

Not sure how the clans battles could have been separated by the PCs. The second group showed up while were were still fighting the first. Not much of a chance to take five minutes and rest.

The only part the PCs realy extended things is when we chased after Luke who had already been bloodied and had used his surges (I wouldn't consider him fresh...). No other NPCs were around so the party pursued. The battle was alread into extra innings at that point.


I'm not saying it was a bad encounter or anything. Just stating that a "normal" encounter usually runs about 10 rounds and that if an encounter is going to run 20-30 rounds, should the PCs have a way to regain some resources?

Dwarmaj wrote:Not sure how the clans battles could have been separated by the PCs. The second group showed up while were were still fighting the first. Not much of a chance to take five minutes and rest.

Not without good roleplaying, you're right. Straightforward hack & slash had no chance.

But, I'm always trying to encourage as much roleplaying as possible, and in this encounter I tried to give as many clues as I could that there was parley potential. (Not a small hint that the girls didn't attack for several rounds + I hid the big guy at the start so he couldn't be attacked before parley attempts could be made)

For example, right after Luke appeared: "Mighty Luke, we're here to entreat with you regarding St Vigeous, let us prove our worth to you on these clan Mui scum then we can talk about how we can help you." <depending on bluff check result> "How do you know about St Vigeous? (to the girls) We will hear what these children have to say."

Or whatever. Lots of roleplaying strategies besides the one: straightforward hack & slash, could have worked.

Dwarmaj wrote:...The only part the PCs realy extended things is...

?? Do you really think the many other PC actions I listed didn't contribute?

Dwarmaj wrote:(I wouldn't consider him fresh...).

Not all his surges. Luke fled the instant he was bloodied, still having his 2nd wind to go. Plus with regeneration for a couple rounds anyway, he was effectively at 3/4 hits. I'd call that fairly fresh when you have almost 500.

I could have second winded vs double attacked before I went down. I also could have ranged attacked with an at will. I just thought Luke was closer to going down and the double radiant attack could have put him down.

I also had a healing potion left.

Yeah, his health bar is a little decieving with 10x the hits as the PCs... but yes, that's another factor. Each PC falling added to the length of the encounter by 1/6.

I thought the others were closer also