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How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent? EmptyMon May 13, 2024 9:09 pm by Teramotos

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How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent? EmptyThu May 02, 2024 10:48 am by Teramotos

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How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent? EmptySun Apr 28, 2024 12:50 am by Teramotos

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How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent? EmptySun Apr 21, 2024 2:53 pm by Teramotos

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How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent? EmptyThu Apr 18, 2024 12:21 pm by Ross

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How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent? EmptyMon Apr 15, 2024 9:15 am by Ross

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How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent? EmptyFri Apr 12, 2024 7:34 pm by Teramotos

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How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent? EmptyThu Apr 04, 2024 8:26 am by Krystoff

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How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent? EmptySun Mar 31, 2024 9:39 pm by Teramotos

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4 posters

    How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent?

    Dwarmaj
    Dwarmaj


    Number of posts : 5285
    Registration date : 2008-11-26

    How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent? Empty How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent?

    Post by Dwarmaj Mon May 07, 2012 4:58 pm

    If I have a power that makes an opponent unconscious, can I use a minor action to take out hand cuffs, then a move to bind them? Or would it take a Standard to cuff them?

    May need a second PC to put a bag over their head so they can't teleport. Twisted Evil
    Ross
    Ross
    Admin


    Number of posts : 3868
    Registration date : 2008-11-26
    Age : 57
    Location : Seattle

    Character sheet
    Campaign: 4e-Against the Giants
    Character Name: Kazoo Noisemaker
    Player Name: Ross

    How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent? Empty Re: How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent?

    Post by Ross Mon May 07, 2012 5:33 pm

    If you handcuff them, or tie them up they can't teleport out of the bonds. They teleport with them. However if you have a chain attached to a wall binding them they can teleport out of that.
    I suspect a standard action to tie someone up, but only thing I could find about binding is:

    IMPROVISING WITH THIEVERY
            Fix a broken wagon (easy DC)
            Craft a standard lock (moderate DC)
            Bind a creature with rope (check result sets escape DC)




    _________________
    CHARACTERS:

    Silk - Human/Hexblade [4e-Dark Nights Rising Campaign]
    Kazoo - Halfling(Kender)/Hybrid(Rogue/Druid) [4e-Against the Giants]
    Morbius Von Kas - Vryloka/Blackguard [4e-Rainbow Warriors Campaign]
    Man'Tis Man'Todea - Thri-Kreen/Berserker [4e-Slave Lords Campaign]
    Nathan Grey - Ardent (4e-Terran One Campaign)
    Walt Dixon - Bladesinger (4e-Terran One Campaign)
    Shandral Aurlong - Human/Sorcerer [5e-Horde of the Dragon Queen Campaign]
    Danilo Rand - Monk/Human [5e-Princes of the Apocalypse Campaign]
    Battlefield Soldier: Saturnicus
    Diablo III Battletag: Saturnus#1572
    Neverwinter: @bobpatrick.com
    XBox GamerTag: Drizityn


    Kazoo the Kender: "Hmm, I'll take....the Wand of Wonder." The rest of the party regretted giving Kazoo the first treasure pick.
    Teramotos
    Teramotos


    Number of posts : 4854
    Registration date : 2008-12-01
    Age : 60
    Location : Seattle

    How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent? Empty Re: How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent?

    Post by Teramotos Mon May 07, 2012 5:34 pm

    definately a minor action to take out the cuffs. Now, normally, any kind of action, even against a helpless opponent to restrain them is a standard action. Just to grab a helpless opponent would be a standard; cuffing them would be harder than grabing them. I'd have to hear a reasonable train of logic before I'd say cuffing someone is a move action. Discuss...


    _________________
    Weslocke "What do you wish to know?"

    Sonya Morecut (Human Warlord) - SG1
    Whey Baker (Human Fighter) - SG1
    Archemedies - (Githyanki Artificer) - Slave Ship
    Alysa Redfield (Human Archer Warlord) - Dark Nights Rising
    Dwarmaj
    Dwarmaj


    Number of posts : 5285
    Registration date : 2008-11-26

    How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent? Empty Re: How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent?

    Post by Dwarmaj Mon May 07, 2012 8:25 pm

    Just wondering if the power is worth taking. Knocking a creature unconscious (save ends) sounds good on paper, but not sure how useful it'll be in actual play.

    It's a level 15 Daily that does no damage on a hit.

    We could Coup de Grace them once they're unconscious, but have to do their bloodied value in damage to instant kill them. Which may be tough against some of the tougher creatures we've run across...
    Teramotos
    Teramotos


    Number of posts : 4854
    Registration date : 2008-12-01
    Age : 60
    Location : Seattle

    How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent? Empty Re: How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent?

    Post by Teramotos Mon May 07, 2012 10:35 pm

    Hmmm...okay, what about this...if a PC is dying, and another PC is four squares away, can they: Move Action, move into the dying PC's square - Minor Action, grab hold of the dying PC - Standard Action, drag dying PC three squares as a Move Action? It's a minor action to pick up an object off the ground, right? Does it follow that picking up a dying PC is also a minor action?

    Now, if picking up a dying (e.g. helpless PC, or any other creature for that matter) is a minor action, is hand cuffing a helpless creature a minor action? I'd still have to say "no" because if you're grabbing (picking up) a dying creature, you really don't care too much where you grab them; i.e. the shoulder, the arm, a foot, etc. Ideally, if you have the time, you'd grasp the back of thier shirt to make pulling them easier.

    Okay, now that I've said all that, if you're picking up a weapon, especially a sword, you'll want to pick it up by the grip (a specific place) so is the preciseness involved in picking up a sword that much less than hand cuffing a helpless creature? It's a close call, but I'd still say that hand cuffing is a standard action...further discussion?


    _________________
    Weslocke "What do you wish to know?"

    Sonya Morecut (Human Warlord) - SG1
    Whey Baker (Human Fighter) - SG1
    Archemedies - (Githyanki Artificer) - Slave Ship
    Alysa Redfield (Human Archer Warlord) - Dark Nights Rising
    Ross
    Ross
    Admin


    Number of posts : 3868
    Registration date : 2008-11-26
    Age : 57
    Location : Seattle

    Character sheet
    Campaign: 4e-Against the Giants
    Character Name: Kazoo Noisemaker
    Player Name: Ross

    How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent? Empty Re: How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent?

    Post by Ross Tue May 08, 2012 6:23 am

    Binding should be a standard action. It's detailed work like using the Thievery Skill.


    _________________
    CHARACTERS:

    Silk - Human/Hexblade [4e-Dark Nights Rising Campaign]
    Kazoo - Halfling(Kender)/Hybrid(Rogue/Druid) [4e-Against the Giants]
    Morbius Von Kas - Vryloka/Blackguard [4e-Rainbow Warriors Campaign]
    Man'Tis Man'Todea - Thri-Kreen/Berserker [4e-Slave Lords Campaign]
    Nathan Grey - Ardent (4e-Terran One Campaign)
    Walt Dixon - Bladesinger (4e-Terran One Campaign)
    Shandral Aurlong - Human/Sorcerer [5e-Horde of the Dragon Queen Campaign]
    Danilo Rand - Monk/Human [5e-Princes of the Apocalypse Campaign]
    Battlefield Soldier: Saturnicus
    Diablo III Battletag: Saturnus#1572
    Neverwinter: @bobpatrick.com
    XBox GamerTag: Drizityn


    Kazoo the Kender: "Hmm, I'll take....the Wand of Wonder." The rest of the party regretted giving Kazoo the first treasure pick.
    avatar
    Kenji


    Number of posts : 3459
    Registration date : 2008-12-02

    How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent? Empty Re: How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent?

    Post by Kenji Tue May 08, 2012 7:40 am

    Ross wrote:Binding should be a standard action. It's detailed work like using the Thievery Skill.

    Concur. I can see however, how modern handcuffs might be an exception. They're made to hit the wrist and self lock.

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    How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent? Empty Re: How long does it take to bind a helpless opponent?

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